Informationen zum Schwiegervater

    I am very sorry for posting in English.


    We are trying to find some information on my father-in-law shown in the photo taken in late 44 or early 45.
    We know he was in tanks and served on the Russian front during the winter of 44, which we think was the northern part of the front, before fighting in the defence of Berlin and surrendering to the British in mid-May and being sent to a POW camp in England.
    It looks like he has a “12” on the shoulder strap button, would that be the 12th Army or the 12th panzer Div?
    He never said that he was anything more than a Private, is the uniform correct for this?


    source: privat
    Quelle: privat

    Hi Bonh4ch and welcome to the forum,


    first of all, have you requested the Deutsche Dienststelle WASt (German Services), there you can fill an online sheet and get all the information that still exists of former Wehrmacht soldiers. If not, here is the link. But don't e scared it lasts to two years to get an answer letter.


    https://www.dd-wast.de/en/home.html


    On thats picture it is kind of hard to get any information. I can not identify the weapons colour. But I can tell you that the 12 on the shoulder strap button stands for the 12th company.
    If there are any other pictures of your father-in-law that would help us. To the question if that fits what he told you, yes it might be. But exact information you will get from the WASt or by other picture.


    I hope I could help you.


    Horrido


    Daniel


    P.S. for further pictures with any Nazi-symbols on it please deface them and tell the source of the picture

    Suche Infos über die Eisenbahnpioniere und die Eisenbahnentseuchungszüge.

    Hello,
    unfortunately you can not take this much information from this picture. But what I can say is that he is wearing a tunic (Waffenrock).


    http://www.wehrmachtlexikon.de/heer/bekleidung/feldgrau/waffenrock.php


    In terms of gun color, I would spontaneously type crimson for the artillery.


    http://www.wehrmachtlexikon.de…adabzeichen/waffenfarben/


    greeting
    Michael

    Thank you for the reply,


    This is the only photo we have and my mother-in-law did not know about this photo until a couple of weeks ago, we are going to get her/his German pension number and request further details.
    He said he was in a tank regiment and sent to the north eastern front, with the “12” on his button we did not know if that would mean the 12thWehrmacht Panzer Division of Army Group North, but that would put him in the Kurland pocket.
    This may fit with what he said about nearly freezing to death on the front, bodies frozen solid under the snow that they sat on thinking they were fallen trees and not being issued winter uniforms until a sergeant shot the officer in charge of the stores and they took the uniforms. How he got from the eastern front to Berlin we do not know but at one point he thought he would be executed by his own side, a large group of them (may be hundreds solders) where told to strip and loaded onto train trucks, then they were taken out of the train told to dress and let go.


    With the short overlap at the collar of the Waffenrock between the buttons and the edge of the fabric, dark collar and shiny buttons is that an officers only tunic. Also on his left shoulder strap just on the very edge of the photo it looks like something around the strap, could that indicate an Officer cadet?

    Hello,


    I believe you have misunderstood something but that probably depends on the translation. The number on the button refers to a company (Kompanie) and not to a division, so in comparison a very small unit.


    A number from a division was not worn on epaulets either. Because we have so far only one company, it is unfortunately not possible to draw conclusions about a regiment or a division. Regarding the tunic, unfortunately I have to correct you as well.


    It is clearly a team service degree with a tunic. Good to recognize on the epaulets or collar plates. What you see on the edge of the picture is a so-called slide-in loop, where a corresponding troop indicator would be recognizable.


    Here are a few examples to better clarify my information.


    http://www.wehrmachtlexikon.de…ppenkennzeichen/index.php


    http://www.wehrmachtlexikon.de…n/truppenkennzeichen1.php


    http://www.wehrmachtlexikon.de…gsabzeichen/nachwuchs.php


    http://www.wehrmachtlexikon.de…feldgrau/kragenpatten.php


    http://www.lexikon-der-wehrmac…Heer/Truppenstaerke-R.htm


    greeting
    Michael


    PS: You can also write with a translator. That would make it easier for us to work.

    Vielen Dank,Michael, dass Sie den Knopf erklärt haben. Könnten Sie uns bitte etwas mehrüber die Tunika erklären? Und was Sie unter „Teamdienstgrad“ verstehen, er warbis mindestens August 1944 Lehrling in Torgau und geht in die Armee Spät habeich erwartet, dass er so etwas wie eine M43-Tunika trägt.



    Thank you Michael for explaining about the button, could you explain a little more about the tunic please, and what you mean by “Team service degree” tunic, he was an apprentice baker in Torgau until at least August 1944, going into the army so late I was expecting him to wear something like an M43 tunic.

    Hallo,

    Zitat von b0nh4ch

    Könnten Sie uns bitte etwas mehrüber die Tunika erklären?

    ist damit der Waffenrock gemeint? Wenn ja, was möchtest du denn dazu genau wissen?

    Zitat von b0nh4ch

    Und was Sie unter „Teamdienstgrad“ verstehen,

    sorry aber diese Frage verstehe ich leider nicht, was ist denn damit genau gemeint?


    Gruß
    Michael


    PS: Die Bezeichnung M43 wird eigentlich nur in Verbindung mit einer Feldbluse und nicht mit einem Waffenrock verwendet:


    http://www.wehrmachtlexikon.de…g/feldgrau/feldblusen.php

    I did not understand, Team service degree with a tunic, but I think the translation should be Rank with a tunic.


    Ich habe nicht verstanden, Team Service mit einer Tunika, aber ich denke, die Übersetzung sollte Rang mit einer Tunika sein.

    Hi Michael,


    I did not understand the meaning of “team service degree”,
    But I think it was the translation to English and you mean “Rank”?